ApolloHoax.net
Apollo Discussions => The Hoax Theory => Topic started by: benparry on November 18, 2017, 07:40:25 AM
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Hey Everybody. i'm sure its nonsense but has anybody any thoughts on the 'theres a stagehand in the astranauts visor reflection' video that's currently doing the rounds on youtube. It looks like its been photoshopped to me but ....
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Hi benparry,
I don't suppose you know which image it is?
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Hey yeah this is the video which refers to it. in my opinion its just another astronaut. for me the shadow is important its of a square indicating a back pack
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Yep, it's the other astronaut, complete with PLSS, visor and camera taking the photo.
(https://i.imgur.com/SZBlfrm.jpg)
The EVA was broadcast on live TV, including from the location of the photograph and no stage hands were shown. The EVA also featured live images of Earth that can be dated precisely, so no. it's not on a stage set.
e2a: The image is AS17-141-21608
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Versions of this claim go back to at least 2008.
So it isn't just bunk, it is recycled bunk.
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ah ok cool. well another one bites the dust lol cheers guys
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ah ok cool. well another one bites the dust lol cheers guys
Welcome to the forum. Most of the images that show "inconsistencies" are misapplication of a little bit of knowledge applied to a mindset of "I know it was faked/photo shopped" and viola we have a conspiracy. The best way to approach any image is to look at the high res ones in the Apollo Lunar Surface Journal(ALSJ) and much is apparent.
https://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/frame.html
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Hey Bknight. I know I have debated quite a few times with people on a couple of facebook forums. some listen and of course some don't lol
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Some Hoax Believers (HBs as they're known around here) have tried to claim that the figure in the above image is not wearing a backpack. However, his shadow clearly shows that he is. We simply can't see it on the figure because he is facing us.
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Hey Bknight. I know I have debated quite a few times with people on a couple of facebook forums. some listen and of course some don't lol
Not seen anything on Facebook, as I have no account, however YT is ripe with people beating their chest in a futile effort to show they "know" what happened and have pointed out one of the largest hoaxes of all time. Unfortunately they don't know a fraction of what they think they know. Debating them is like nailing jello to a wall, changing directions, claiming superior knowledge etc.
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agreed agreed.
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Phil Plait (The Bad Astronomer) has a go at debunking this:
http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/no-thats-not-a-stagehand-in-an-apollo-astronaut-photo
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From that article
their (HB's) "proof" boils down to misreading photos, misunderstanding science, misunderstanding engineering, misunderstanding politics, and/or outright deception in order to mislead the public
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Or, as our own chrlz puts it:
"The Apollo deniers stock-in-trade is to feed on the non-experts their non-expert opinions and their hatred of authority/USA/anyone-who-succeeds-in-life; with a view towards either their five minutes of fame (only amongst the gullible) an attempt to make a buck by selling books or videos or the genuine but sadly deluded belief that they are onto something."
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Fox appears to be happily resurrecting their moon hoax "just asking questions" position: http://www.foxnews.com/science/2017/11/20/apollo-moon-landing-was-faked-conspiracy-theorists-claim-with-new-photo.html.
If I were a conspiracy theorist, I'd suspect that their goal was to throw NASA and other respected science agencies into disrepute, thereby enabling them to claim that global warming isn't occurring, and natural disasters are the result of gay marriage.
Let us not forget that the U.S. President eagerly gulps down all the information that Fox puts out.
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I started reading the comments and quickly wanted to bang people's heads into solid things.
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after seeing all this only people who want to believe in the theory do lol
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Too bad Fox News, we already know your game.
Let's start:
First off: It is not a video. It is a B/W photo made with a Hasselblad 500EL/M camera.
Secondly: No, the 'video' (actually photo) is not ' Newly discovered ' the photo has been known for a long time.
Third: It is not a new "Discovery" , the hoax theory about this picture is already old.
The claim: The reflection shows a placement hand, someone without PLSS
The photo: AS17-141-21608
(https://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a17/AS17-141-21608HR.jpg)
Photo made by Jack Schmitt, shows Gene Cernan. Jack Schmitt can be seen in visor reflection.
Now that we know the photo, we can see if the TV camera was active at that time. After all, this is Apollo 17, so the TV camera was on the LRV.
Yes!:
The astronauts, both clearly with suits: http://apollo17.org?t=165:09:20
Moment the photo was: http://apollo17.org?t=165:16:41
The crop that everyone is talking about:
(https://i.imgur.com/SZBlfrm.jpg)
Let's compare the suit with an astronaut in the same direction:
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/LYvw7DvGzzU/hqdefault.jpg)
What else do we see? the shadow of Gene Cernan clearly shows the PLSS. The protruding part in the middle of the austronaut is a hand and/or Hasselblad 500EL /M camera.
Example of camera at the top left:
https://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a17/AS17-136-20739HR.jpg
For closure, here is a photo made by Gene Cernan who shows Schmitt jacket with the complete suit:
NASA photo ID: AS17-140-21496
TV: http://apollo17.org?t=165:34:53
Photo: https://spaceflight.nasa.gov/gallery/images/apollo/apollo17/hires/as17-140-21496.jpg
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thanks guys for all the answers. you may remember me saying that I had debated with a guy about this on FB. well he has created a youtube video all of his own lol here it is. anyone fancy a crack at it
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Ah our old nemesis, hunbacked. He has some very pronounced visual perceptions, look at his video concerning A12 when Pete and Alan were at the Surveyor looking back towards the LM. He tells you what to expect and then shows you exactly what he describes and has thaudacity to tell everyone no the image didn't "look right", ka9q has tried vainly to correct his misguided beliefs, to no avail.
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I have looked at his video concerning buzz Aldrin in which he lies about buzz not saluting with his right hand when he clearly does. What did you think of this video
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Also after I sent to him all of your replies he said to me that the life support system is rectangular and the shadow is square lol
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Hunchbacked (Pascal Xavier) is less of a nemesis and more of a card-carrying nutjob. As others have said, he's has demonstrated numerous times that he appears to have serious problems with comprehending simple spatial concepts. I think that his eyes are painted on.... ;-) ::)
There's absolutely no point in debating with him as he is impervious to change.
The mildly amusing thing is that he tries to debunk David Icke's claims (http://www.angelfire.com/moon2/xpascal/MoonHoax/Disinfo/Disinfo.HTM) about the shadows being "wrong", yet Hunchbacked uses many of the same arguments in some of his videos.
What.
A.
Weirdo.
:o
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lol really. what did you think of his the shadow is square comment
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lol really. what did you think of his the shadow is square comment
The same that I think about all his other drivel. It's arrant nonsense.
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lol fair enough. he does seem to be ignorant to his own errors
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Also discussed on Metabunk here: https://www.metabunk.org/apollo-17-helmet-reflection-shows-an-unsuited-stage-hand.t9264/
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ah ok thanks rob. did you happen to have a look at the video I attached of hunbacked. what did you think of his comments
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Ben
As others have posted hunchbacked has spatial recognition problems, so just about anything he comments on is pure bunk. I have debated with him calling him out on his visual perceptions and just laughed me off.
BTW Phil Plait has a nice piece on the A17 visor image
http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/no-thats-not-a-stagehand-in-an-apollo-astronaut-photo
The shadow on the ground is of the PLSS, regardless of what he may say about it. I wouldn't waste too much time on him, as Zakalwe has indicated hunchbacked is hard cored convinced that Apollo was faked, and not much will change his mind.
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It's pretty hilarious some of the things Hunchbacked comes up with. For instance, he's made the claim in the past that the astronauts were either under the influence of some kind of CIA mind control device or on drugs such as LSD or both at the same time.
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Wasn't it Huncgbacked that came up with the cracker that the Buzz and Neil were wearing breathing masks as the interior shots were filmed underwater? All because he thought that the movements of objects in the cabin were "wrong". It takes a special* sort of mind to do those types of mental gymnastics.
*"Special" as in not firing on all cylinders. Not the sharpest tool in the shed. A few slices short of a full loaf. Not capable of emptying pee out of a boot with the instructions written on the heel.
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lol oh my lord. fair enough i didnt realise i had found a nut job. even to my inexperienced mind he seems to be very wrong on some basic things.
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lol oh my lord. fair enough i didnt realise i had found a nut job. even to my inexperienced mind he seems to be very wrong on some basic things.
And he is an engineer as well at least that is what his diploma indicates.
EDIT:
His diploma is still on the internet.
http://www.angelfire.com/moon2/xpascal/Diplomes/DiplomeOriginal.jpg
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lol oh my lord. fair enough i didnt realise i had found a nut job. even to my inexperienced mind he seems to be very wrong on some basic things.
And he is an engineer as well at least that is what his diploma indicates.
EDIT:
His diploma is still on the internet.
http://www.angelfire.com/moon2/xpascal/Diplomes/DiplomeOriginal.jpg
Well, he may have been an engineer once. You only have to look at people like Anders Bjorkmann (Heiwa), Dr. Patrick Tekeli (fattydash/Dr. Socks/a thousand other sock puppet accounts) or Neil Baker (https://www.independent.com/news/2013/dec/12/former-ucsb-employee-neil-baker-sentenced-probatio/) to see how physical or mental illness can turn someone into a hoax nut.
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lol oh my lord. fair enough i didnt realise i had found a nut job. even to my inexperienced mind he seems to be very wrong on some basic things.
And he is an engineer as well at least that is what his diploma indicates.
EDIT:
His diploma is still on the internet.
http://www.angelfire.com/moon2/xpascal/Diplomes/DiplomeOriginal.jpg
Well, he may have been an engineer once. You only have to look at people like Anders Bjorkmann (Heiwa), Dr. Patrick Tekeli (fattydash/Dr. Socks/a thousand other sock puppet accounts) or Neil Baker (https://www.independent.com/news/2013/dec/12/former-ucsb-employee-neil-baker-sentenced-probatio/) to see how physical or mental illness can turn someone into a hoax nut.
I agree 100% being an engineer myself, it pains me to consider Pascal Xavier and Neil Baker engineers. I don't know about Bjorkmann, isn't he a ship wreck analyzer? Patrick is a medical doctor from memory so he could conceivably be forgiven for not know engineering matters, but not for being a dumbass.