Author Topic: Gardum's thread  (Read 2211 times)

Offline Zakalwe

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #15 on: September 05, 2017, 06:59:41 PM »
Im willing to wager that our new arrival is a seagull poster. I suspect that he's made his only contribution and we'll not hear from him again.
"Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur"
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.” – Christopher Hitchens.

Offline Bryanpoprobson

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #16 on: September 05, 2017, 07:09:09 PM »
He is quite persistent on YouTube.
"Wise men speak because they have something to say!" "Fools speak, because they have to say something!" (Plato)

Offline bknight

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #17 on: September 05, 2017, 07:12:03 PM »
Im willing to wager that our new arrival is a seagull poster. I suspect that he's made his only contribution and we'll not hear from him again.

You're probably correct, but I hope not it was a breath of fresh air to the postings of the last year.
Truth needs no defense.  Nobody can take those footsteps I made on the surface of the moon away from me.
Eugene Cernan

Offline smartcooky

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #18 on: September 05, 2017, 10:15:41 PM »
He is quite persistent on YouTube.

You say that like it's good thing

IMO he comes across as someone who thinks he knows far more than he actually does. It was disappointing to see a new poster fall at the first hurdle; a lack of understanding of basic schoolboy science.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2017, 10:17:42 PM by smartcooky »
► What you can assert without evidence, I can dismiss without evidence
► When you argue with idiots you risk being dragged down to their level and beaten with experience.
►"Conspiracism is a shortcut to the illusion of erudition

Offline Ranb

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #19 on: September 05, 2017, 11:23:00 PM »
First people on the Moon never done before never landed a manned vehicle on the Moon all first time events as none of the equipment they used had ever been tested in a Lunar environment.

Well, it is true that the Apollo 11 crew had not landed a vehicle on the moon prior to July 1969, but Apollo 9 did test the LM in Earth orbit, and Apollo 10 operated the LM in a lunar environment when testing the abort procedure.  Don't forget the unmanned test of the LM on Apollo 5.  There were also several Surveyor missions to the Moon which tested systems required for soft landings. 

Someone had to be first to land on the moon, it just so happens that the crew of Apollo 11 was chosen to do so after many tests and missions were successful.  Everything had to happen the 1st time eventually.  Saying something never happened before is not a good reason to doubt that it ever happened.

ranb
« Last Edit: September 05, 2017, 11:25:05 PM by Ranb »

Offline smartcooky

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #20 on: September 06, 2017, 12:52:06 AM »
First people on the Moon never done before never landed a manned vehicle on the Moon all first time events as none of the equipment they used had ever been tested in a Lunar environment.

Well, it is true that the Apollo 11 crew had not landed a vehicle on the moon prior to July 1969, but Apollo 9 did test the LM in Earth orbit, and Apollo 10 operated the LM in a lunar environment when testing the abort procedure.  Don't forget the unmanned test of the LM on Apollo 5.  There were also several Surveyor missions to the Moon which tested systems required for soft landings. 

Someone had to be first to land on the moon, it just so happens that the crew of Apollo 11 was chosen to do so after many tests and missions were successful.  Everything had to happen the 1st time eventually.  Saying something never happened before is not a good reason to doubt that it ever happened.

ranb


Hillary and Tenzing were first to climb Everest. Must have been fake because no-one did it before
The Mongolfier  brothers were the first to get airborne in hot air balloon. Must have been fake because no-one did it before
Yuri Gagarin was the first man to orbit the Earth in a space capsule. Must have been fake because no-one did it before
John Alcock and Arthur Brown were the first men to fly across the Atlantic Ocean.  Must have been fake because no-one did it before

etc, etc etc.
► What you can assert without evidence, I can dismiss without evidence
► When you argue with idiots you risk being dragged down to their level and beaten with experience.
►"Conspiracism is a shortcut to the illusion of erudition

Offline nomuse

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #21 on: September 06, 2017, 01:15:12 AM »
Sigh. Another Gish Gallop.

He seems to be trying to make a general, systemic point; pointing at general attitudes and trends of argument. But he's trying to support that general argument with severely under-argued specific points. All at once in one big jumble.

He doesn't just need to know what a paragraph is, he needs to know what it does. And how, too, to structure an essay. He speaks all his part at once, cues and all.

Offline Obviousman

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #22 on: September 06, 2017, 03:50:11 AM »
And let's not forget the LLTV. Armstrong himself said though it was actually hazardous, it was essential and recommend that all future LM CDRs undertake training in it.

Offline Bryanpoprobson

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #23 on: September 06, 2017, 04:00:32 AM »


You say that like it's good thing

IMO he comes across as someone who thinks he knows far more than he actually does. It was disappointing to see a new poster fall at the first hurdle; a lack of understanding of basic schoolboy science.

I expressed those exact sentiments on a youtube post of his yesterday. But for the first time in months he seems to not be replying.
"Wise men speak because they have something to say!" "Fools speak, because they have to say something!" (Plato)

Offline Zakalwe

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #24 on: September 06, 2017, 04:41:45 AM »
He is quite persistent on YouTube.

This place is not the swamp that is YouTube. Gardum will not find his comments being "liked" or replied to with comments like "hur, hur, hur, yeah astro-noughts". His words will be critically examined and if found wanting, will be ripped to shreds. He clearly has neither the knowledge or the clarity of thinking to be able to support any of the garbage that he has posted. hence, my feelings that he will be nothing more than a seagull poster.

If he does come back then I will be surprised and would expect him to implode and flounce shortly afterwards.
"Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur"
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.” – Christopher Hitchens.

Offline Bryanpoprobson

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #25 on: September 06, 2017, 04:51:27 AM »

This place is not the swamp that is YouTube. Gardum will not find his comments being "liked" or replied to with comments like "hur, hur, hur, yeah astro-noughts". His words will be critically examined and if found wanting, will be ripped to shreds. He clearly has neither the knowledge or the clarity of thinking to be able to support any of the garbage that he has posted. hence, my feelings that he will be nothing more than a seagull poster.

If he does come back then I will be surprised and would expect him to implode and flounce shortly afterwards.

In a way that is why I pushed him in this direction, from my discussions there does seem to be a bit of light and I always like to think that someone can be turned from the dark side. :) I have succeeded three times to my knowledge but this guy needed some extra guns.
"Wise men speak because they have something to say!" "Fools speak, because they have to say something!" (Plato)

Offline Zakalwe

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #26 on: September 06, 2017, 05:13:41 AM »
In a way that is why I pushed him in this direction, from my discussions there does seem to be a bit of light and I always like to think that someone can be turned from the dark side. :) I have succeeded three times to my knowledge but this guy needed some extra guns.

Wilful ignorance is entirely in the hands of the individual, but the nature of their delusion is that they are, in the main, emotionally wedded to their crazy beliefs.

It's the ultimate irony that the ones that bang-on about "truthers", "believers" "closed minds" are the very ones that are the most closed-minded and refuse to even try to learn.  Personally I think that the only benefit to be gained from entertaining them is to show an innocent bystander, who may be genuinely interested in learning, just how ridiculous the whole hoax-belief  crock-of-BS really is.


<edit> Correct quotation error.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2017, 06:03:43 AM by Zakalwe »
"Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur"
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.” – Christopher Hitchens.

Offline Zakalwe

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #27 on: September 06, 2017, 05:21:22 AM »
all first time events as none of the equipment they used had ever been tested in a Lunar environment.

^^An example of lazy thinking^^ Ten minutes on Wikipedia would have relieved Gardum of his clear ignorance of early test flights in the program https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Apollo_missions. He is also clearly ignorant of the tests of the spacesuits in both vacuum chamber tests and LEO tests, the flights of Apollo 8 (testing cis-Lunar flight, LOI, TEI etc.), Apollo 10 (all of the above, Lunar descent, Lunar abort sequences and orbital insertion).

His post is a shameful display of ignorance.
"Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur"
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.” – Christopher Hitchens.

Offline Obviousman

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #28 on: September 06, 2017, 05:30:08 AM »
Please be fair. Give them a chance to reply. They may be unavailable due work, or other reason.

Offline Jason Thompson

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Re: Gardum's thread
« Reply #29 on: September 06, 2017, 07:16:29 AM »
Hello,

Hello and welcome.

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Ask any truther and temperature works like magic in space and on the Moon

Nope, temperature works in very defined ways everywhere.

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NASA states below 56C in the shade which would make any Film unusable but of course Silver Anodising stops anything from getting hot or cold as truthers will say.

Nope. Things left in the dark on the Moon for up to two weeks reach that low temperature. Thermal control in a vacuum is a well-studied science. Presumably you believe all photography using film in space to be faked, since they would have the same supposed 'problem'.

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NASA states 123C in the Sun on the Moon at the minimum because of the time they landed.
Funny thing is from all scientific sites I could find once the Sun shines on anything in space and on the Moon it doesn't matter what time of day it is as there is no atmosphere for the Sun to go through to lesson it's effects.

It does matter what time of day it is for the same reason time of day (and season) makes a difference to temperature here on Earth. It's not a function of atmosphere but angle of illumination. Low sun angle results in slower heating than high sun angle.
 
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Yet when it comes to the Moon it's all SPECIAL no metal objects get to hot or too cold, must have been the Goldilocks time of day on the Moon each time.

That and the different thermal properties of every object and spacecraft.

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Not one of you people look at the video and see them moving in slow motion and have one problem with it,

No, I don't have a problem because I don't see them moving in slow motion. I see them working with their hands and arms at the same pace they do on Earth. I see movements influenced by gravity being slower and that's all. Try speeding up the video of all the missions and find a section that shows an astronaut using his hands and arms that doesn't look ludicrously sped up.

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First people on the Moon never done before never landed a manned vehicle on the Moon

Test pilots flying new planes for the first time don't know if it's going to land safely or slam into the ground, or break up in mid-flight. Ultimately the only way to test a spacecraft designed to be piloted to a safe landing on the Moon is to put two people in it and get them to pilot it to a landing, just as the only way to fully test a new aircraft is to put a pilot in it and get him to fly it.

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all first time events as none of the equipment they used had ever been tested in a Lunar environment.

Apollo 5, 9 and 10 all tested the lunar module in every aspect of its capability except the landing itself. Apollo 11 was the final test. Risky? Undoubtedly. Unbelievably so? Not at all.

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Yet they went from a less than 60% success rate to a 100% for every manned mission.

Improvements in success rates during development of technology are expected. Every manned flight had a glitch of some kind, and Apollo 13 was not a success in terms of its main objective. That is not a 100% success rate.

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Years later they couldn't get close to this with the Shuttle missions.

Two failures 17 years apart in over 100 flights across three decades isn't close to a 100% success rate?

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I am sure I will get a few responses that Believers would never lie or make things up :)

No, you'll get responses that deal with the substance of your posts. no-one here takes Apollo on blind faith.
"There's this idea that everyone's opinion is equally valid. My arse! Bloke who was a professor of dentistry for forty years does NOT have a debate with some eejit who removes his teeth with string and a door!"  - Dara O'Briain