Author Topic: A sad development - Marcus Allen at the BIS?  (Read 52576 times)

Offline Daggerstab

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Re: A sad development - Marcus Allen at the BIS?
« Reply #45 on: May 20, 2012, 05:36:11 AM »
I really should be doing other things now, but...

Here's video from the event:




And here is how they see it at Aulis:
http://www.aulis.com/allen_bis.htm

Offline ChrLz

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Re: A sad development - Marcus Allen at the BIS?
« Reply #46 on: May 20, 2012, 07:50:39 AM »
I really should be doing other things now
Me too, but... :D  Thanks for the youtube links - maybe if my broadband connection ever works properly (Hi, Vodafone..) I'll watch them.

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And here is how they see it at Aulis:
http://www.aulis.com/allen_bis.htm

On my goodness!  I have just had a look at that.. and saved the page to my hd (I ain't giving them any more than one hit) for a good old fashioned shredding ..er.. analysis.

But I might start a new thread and give out a challenge to AULIS and in particular "MDM Bennett" who is listed as the article author.  Who or what is an 'MDM Bennett'?

I'd be happy to go through every claim made on that page and give it the credibility it oh-so deserves...  Not by handwaving and unsupported claims as per the usual Aulis technique, but via cited, referenced, logical, step by step analysis.

Offline scooter

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Re: A sad development - Marcus Allen at the BIS?
« Reply #47 on: May 20, 2012, 11:19:31 PM »
But I might start a new thread and give out a challenge to AULIS and in particular "MDM Bennett" who is listed as the article author.  Who or what is an 'MDM Bennett'?


perhaps "Madam"?

Offline Glom

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Re: Re: A sad development - Marcus Allen at the BIS?
« Reply #48 on: May 21, 2012, 01:24:51 AM »
What, no more disinfo payments?! Okay, I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore! It's time to launch Operation: Occupy NASA! ;)

Come on to Houston, the mayor was very cooperative with the small occupy Houston crowd.  We can set up at the JSC rocket park, there is an air conditioned building and we can sleep inside the Saturn 5 inter-stage sections.  How cool would that be?

Sleep inside a Saturn V? Who do you think you are? Pete Conrad?

Offline Zakalwe

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Re: A sad development - Marcus Allen at the BIS?
« Reply #49 on: May 21, 2012, 03:16:23 AM »


Many thanks to you two guys -- it's really great to get the good oil.

Please, Zakalwe, could you post for us full bibliographical info about the issue.  Full details of magazine, date, pages etc.  Sorry if you've already done that, but if so, I missed it.  Brain has been on holiday recently.

Here you go: LINK

P 237 Spaceflight magazine Vol 54 No 06. June 2012
"The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.' " - Isaac Asimov

Offline Echnaton

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Re: A sad development - Marcus Allen at the BIS?
« Reply #50 on: May 21, 2012, 06:54:55 AM »
Sleep inside a Saturn V? Who do you think you are? Pete Conrad?
In my dreams.
The sun shone, having no alternative, on the nothing new. —Samuel Beckett

Offline Kiwi

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Re: A sad development - Marcus Allen at the BIS?
« Reply #51 on: May 22, 2012, 10:09:54 AM »
Who or what is an 'MDM Bennett'?

Mary D M Bennett, co-author with David S Percy of:
Dark Moon -- Apollo and the Whistle-Blowers, Mary Bennett and David S Percy, Aulis Publishers, London, 1999.
Also Editor of The Only Planet of Choice., Gateway Books.
Don't criticize what you can't understand. — Bob Dylan, “The Times They Are A-Changin'” (1963)
Some people think they are thinking when they are really rearranging their prejudices and superstitions. — Edward R. Murrow (1908–65)

Offline JayUtah

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Re: A sad development - Marcus Allen at the BIS?
« Reply #52 on: May 22, 2012, 12:46:57 PM »
If there's one word I would use to describe most hoax-believers, it's that one:  Ignorant.

I agree, but to be accurate we have to qualify that as "willfully ignorant."  Ignorance per se is sufferable.  I know as little about embroidery as you do, and although we wallow in ignorance we are smart enough not to profess expertise -- especially among those who are highly skilled at it, such as my sister.  I don't go to museums, look at the elaborate tapestries, and proclaim them fakes just because I lack the skill and patience to execute them.

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There were a few people who taught me, and the best was JayUtah.

Thank you for that.  I continue to be humbled and pleased that my efforts actually matter.  At the risk of blowing my own horn, this thread http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=235690 was originally posted in the JREF Conspiracy Theory section but has since been moved to a members-only section.  For those who aren't JREF members, it's a list of nominations for outstanding posters, which mentions me among several others.  I am always flattered and humbled to read things like this from people.

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Then when I heard Marcus Allen of the British edition speaking, saying he was a photographer and rubbishing the Apollo photos, I was astonished at how ignorant he was of photographic principles that were quite basic to me, and probably part of many of the beginners' and advanced courses I taught.  He didn't seem to be much more knowledgeable than Rene, who was not a photographer.

These days anyone can be a "photographer" in the sense that nearly everyone these days owns at least one camera.  The explosion of camera ownership and digital publication via Flickr, etc. gives the impression that a lot of people are photographers.  But as say, there is much to be learned about good photography, from both the artistic perspective and the technical side.  So many of these self-proclaimed photographers know almost nothing about the principles of photography that apply to their claims.

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I guess it is in the monetary interests of the Nexus publishers to keep the conspiracy and "alien spacecraft" and mystery stuff going, and to occasionally publish only the mildest dissent in the letters column to keep up appearances of being balanced.

Well, you never know.  Richard Hoagland and the Enterprise Mission do a fairly good job of appealing to the standard woo-woo crowd but at the same time adamantly supporting the claim that the Moon landings were real.
"Facts are stubborn things." --John Adams

Offline Chew

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Re: A sad development - Marcus Allen at the BIS?
« Reply #53 on: May 22, 2012, 05:54:15 PM »
Yeah but Hoagland et al only support the Moon landings because it fits their ideology about alien structures on the Moon, not because of the evidence for it.

Offline Chew

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Re: A sad development - Marcus Allen at the BIS?
« Reply #54 on: May 22, 2012, 09:56:25 PM »
I really should be doing other things now, but...

Here's video from the event:


I'm paraphrasing Allen here but he said, "... picture taken to ensure the landing leg isn't damaged so they can take off again."

Oh, man. I haven't gotten to parts 2 and 3 yet but I hope someone ripped out his asshole with a rusty chainsaw for saying that.

Offline Chew

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Re: A sad development - Marcus Allen at the BIS?
« Reply #55 on: May 22, 2012, 11:10:04 PM »
Everything else said about a prestigious science institute giving a conspiracy loon undeserved publicity notwithstanding, as long as Allen's presentation was given to the man who will attempt to rebut it long before the debate and Allen is forbidden to discuss material not in his presentation then it shouldn't be a complete disaster.

Yep. Allen ambushed him. At the start of part 2 Stone says he asked Allen for the photos he was going to use but Allen introduced extra photos into his talk.

Good for Stone for discussing the implication of Allen's premise that men walked on the Moon but the photographic record was faked. Stone seems to be the only member of the BIS who was aware of the conspiracy mindset.

Offline VincentMcConnell

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Re: A sad development - Marcus Allen at the BIS?
« Reply #56 on: June 13, 2012, 10:26:53 PM »
Marcus Allen is still around? LOL.
I thought he comes from the ancient days of the crowd around Bart Sibrel.
"It looks better now, Al. What change did you make?"
"I just hit it on the top with my hammer."

-Mission Control and Alan Bean on Apollo 12 after the TV camera failed.

Offline Chew

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Re: A sad development - Marcus Allen at the BIS?
« Reply #57 on: July 29, 2013, 09:54:38 PM »
You can't teach a conspiracy theorist new tricks. Nor how to evaluate evidence.

Talk on Moon landing hoax allegations - Local - Hastings and St. Leonards Observer

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Marcus Allen, British distributor and publisher of Nexus, a bi-monthly alternative news magazine, is in Hastings on Saturday, August 3 at the Cinque Port pub in All Saints Street, from 2pm to 5.30pm.

During the talk, entitled The Apollo Moon Landings: Fact Or Fiction?, Marcus will be examining various pieces of evidence and theories that cast the whole historic event into doubt.
More at the link.