Author Topic: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery  (Read 77328 times)

Offline raven

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #270 on: July 25, 2019, 05:46:40 PM »
Just as a critique as a story, but that sounds like a really terrible idea for a book. Howard Hughes was something of a genius, but that goes beyond any form of credulity.

Offline Abaddon

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #271 on: July 25, 2019, 06:29:16 PM »
This takes the cake...
Quote
If people insist on asking me questions, but then don't like my answers - can I suggest they stop asking me questions?


Offline raven

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #272 on: July 25, 2019, 07:21:55 PM »
This takes the cake...
Quote
If people insist on asking me questions, but then don't like my answers - can I suggest they stop asking me questions?
I literally snerked* in real life when I read this. Bet it would work real well with the police and in court.
*a kind of mixed giggle snort

Offline JayUtah

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #273 on: July 25, 2019, 08:00:58 PM »
My understanding is that his flounce here was predicated on the impression that he had been defamed and that the sales of some book would be, or had been damaged.  He said he felt that it would be improper of him to participate further here without first resolving the legal implications of those impressions.  If, as it has been represented here, he never did believe himself to have a legally actionable case and had no intention of pursuing it, then I question in what way he must consider the matter to be yet unresolved.  If there is nothing left to resolve here, then I suggest nothing prevents him from returning here and attempting to show himself accountable for the material he published at Aulis.  His willingness and ability to do that will certainly inform my willingness to read his lengthier book on the subject.
"Facts are stubborn things." --John Adams

Offline Obviousman

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #274 on: July 25, 2019, 08:12:06 PM »
Wheeee. Now we are using PM to co-ordinate an attack on poor Derek over on UM, apparently.

Admittedly he was been hammered from all sides but that was only because he wouldn't give meaningful answers to direct questions.

Offline Obviousman

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #275 on: July 25, 2019, 08:16:07 PM »
This takes the cake...
Quote
If people insist on asking me questions, but then don't like my answers - can I suggest they stop asking me questions?
I literally snerked* in real life when I read this. Bet it would work real well with the police and in court.
*a kind of mixed giggle snort

Is that anything like a Burp Snart?



Offline JayUtah

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #276 on: July 25, 2019, 08:26:52 PM »
Admittedly he was been hammered from all sides but that was only because he wouldn't give meaningful answers to direct questions.

I would say that anyone who writes provocative material and then volunteers to discuss it in public forums peopled largely by critics who are both well equipped and well motivated to dispute him essentially deserves what he gets.  Complaints of being too overwhelmed or too consumed by other concerns to offer meaningful discussion don't ring harmoniously to me in that event.
« Last Edit: July 25, 2019, 08:39:32 PM by JayUtah »
"Facts are stubborn things." --John Adams

Offline onebigmonkey

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #277 on: July 26, 2019, 12:47:24 AM »
Given that every other post of his is "buy my book" it's pretty obvious what motive underpins his trolling.

In between his self-promotion it's the standard HB argument: I demand evidence of a very specific type. I'm demanding it because I'm pretty sure it doesn't exist.
« Last Edit: July 26, 2019, 12:50:04 AM by onebigmonkey »

Offline raven

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #278 on: July 26, 2019, 01:04:27 AM »
I literally snerked* in real life when I read this. Bet it would work real well with the police and in court.
*a kind of mixed giggle snort

Is that anything like a Burp Snart?


Thankfully, no. It's more an all at once deal, and it sounds, well, more a less like how it's spelled, a chortle and a snort mixed.
In between his self-promotion it's the standard HB argument: I demand evidence of a very specific type. I'm demanding it because I'm pretty sure it doesn't exist.
'And if shown it does exists, I will pretend it doesn't or try and claim this doesn't actually count'.
« Last Edit: July 26, 2019, 01:06:04 AM by raven »

Offline JayUtah

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #279 on: July 26, 2019, 09:05:41 AM »
Given that every other post of his is "buy my book" it's pretty obvious what motive underpins his trolling.

That would make him fit right in at Aulis.  I got the impression from Bennett and Percy that they didn't have the slightest interest in Apollo or the historical record and were interested merely in lining their pockets at the expense of the gullible.  And Ralph Rene had the same opinion of them, ironically.

Quote
In between his self-promotion it's the standard HB argument: I demand evidence of a very specific type. I'm demanding it because I'm pretty sure it doesn't exist.

Doesn't exist or is of a nature that makes it onerous to produce.  Either way, I'll bet he's asking for it because he's sure it won't be produced.  Not because it's sine qua non evidence.
"Facts are stubborn things." --John Adams

Offline bknight

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #280 on: July 26, 2019, 10:35:16 AM »
Given that every other post of his is "buy my book" it's pretty obvious what motive underpins his trolling.

In between his self-promotion it's the standard HB argument: I demand evidence of a very specific type. I'm demanding it because I'm pretty sure it doesn't exist.

Or he falls back onto "if "John" is correct" lame excuse.
Truth needs no defense.  Nobody can take those footsteps I made on the surface of the moon away from me.
Eugene Cernan

Offline gillianren

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #281 on: July 26, 2019, 11:26:33 AM »
Thankfully, no. It's more an all at once deal, and it sounds, well, more a less like how it's spelled, a chortle and a snort mixed.

That's funny, since a chortle is a chuckle and a snort mixed, per the creator of the word!
"This sounds like a job for Bipolar Bear . . . but I just can't seem to get out of bed!"

"Conspiracy theories are an irresistible labour-saving device in the face of complexity."  --Henry Louis Gates

Offline JayUtah

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #282 on: July 26, 2019, 11:28:58 AM »
Shifting accountability is another classic Aulis stunt.  They published an anonymous film clip as actual footage of the Surveyor taken during the Apollo 12 landing.  Mary Bennett assured us it was legitimate NASA footage, although couldn't account for its provenance.  Under pressure she finally admitted it was taken from a German documentary on Apollo.  She insisted that any fault for it not being original NASA footage, as she claimed, must certainly lie with the producers of that film, not with her.  Under further pressure she admitted that the documentary didn't purport it to be actual footage of the landing.

Similarly, in researching the "Una Ronald" story, I followed up on the claim that the West Australian had published letters from people noting, as had "Una," that there was an errant soda bottle bouncing across the lunar surface in the television coverage.  Aulis authors claimed they had contacted the West Australian to confirm this, but were met only with silence.  When I asked the same question as they, I got an answer back within 24 hours to tell me the archivist had scoured the issues for two weeks after the Apollo 11 mission and had found no such publication.  Again Mary Bennett foisted blame for that onto the West Australian, maintaining that while they may have been kind and polite to me, they had ignored her.

But then the whole "Una Ronald" story itself stinks to high heaven.  As does the "Bill Wood" or "Woods" story, the "David Groves" story, and the whole faculty of hitherto unknown Russian academics they rely upon.  It seems that Derek has learned the lessons well from his publishers about how to escape intellectual accountability for claims he intends to use to make money.
"Facts are stubborn things." --John Adams

Offline JayUtah

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #283 on: July 26, 2019, 11:33:52 AM »
That's funny, since a chortle is a chuckle and a snort mixed, per the creator of the word!

But also I think snerk is a perfectly frabjous word.
"Facts are stubborn things." --John Adams

Offline Von_Smith

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Re: Apollo 12 and the Surveyor 3 Mystery
« Reply #284 on: July 26, 2019, 11:51:50 AM »
That's funny, since a chortle is a chuckle and a snort mixed, per the creator of the word!

But also I think snerk is a perfectly frabjous word.

It's a snortmanteau.